CED VideoDisc and Player Discussion

[cedmagic]

This wasn't much of a news story, but as of March 1 no more television sets with just an analog tuner are being imported to the USA. They all must now have a digital tuner in addition to the analog tuner (or no tuner at all). And on February 17, 2009 there may be no more analog broadcasts period. It will be weird turning on analog-only TVs at that time and be unable to receive anything. Of course you'll still be able to play your CED's on them.

The digital transition will have some ramifications for CED players with RF (Channel 3/4) outputs only, as some of the new tunerless TVs have no RF connection. They all still have composite inputs, and those shouldn't be going away any time soon. But RF-only CED players will need the composite mod or an external Channel 3 to composite demodulator box to work with the digital-only or tunerless TVs. The demodulator option does not produce as good a picture as pulling composite video directly out of the CED player.

--Tom Howe

[brother]

The Uk is due to be totally digital by 2012 -being achieved in phases (Worcester scheduled 2010)

No sign of loosing the RF in the uk as we have FREEVIEW - digital TV via Aerial and local transmitters (In addition to satellite/cable tv) I suppose States dont have a freeview option?

One option if the tv looses RF -is to keep the old VCR powered up and use the RF input on that for the CED player . The analogue VCR can then be connected to the new TV (Without RF) - either by composite (States standard) or Scart socket (European Standard), you can then view any RF channel (Once video tuned in) via Av on the TV.

Regards
steve spill
Worcester UK
_________________
All the girls love me like a brother

[Jesse Skeen]

"It will be weird turning on analog-only TVs at that time and be unable to receive anything."

With TV the way it is right now, that will probably be an improvement!
_________________
Videodisc and stereo sound- there's no better value around!

[RT9342]

"With TV the way it is right now, that will probably be an improvement!"

You're probably right - I got to the point now that my TV is ONLY used for watching videos (CED, LaserDisc, or DVD) and playing games.

But fortunately, it's VERY easy to mod the RF-only players - the easiest way, if you don't want to drill holes or anything, is get an AV cable, cut off the ends on one side, and feed it through the opening where the cord fits through. There's enough room for it to fit down to the bottom board. I don't remember the exact test points, but there's 2 test points that can be directly connected to for audio/video out. The video may look a little bright, but you can use a resistor (120 ohms more or less) to darken it a little. And if you want to be on the safe side (just to prevent possible ESD damage), you can use a capacitor on the audio test point (1-10 microfarads should be sufficient).

[Jesse Skeen]

Yeah, but what good is a mono CED player anyways? They're best used only as parts to keep the stereo players alive!
_________________
Videodisc and stereo sound- there's no better value around!

[RT9342]

But how many of your discs are actually stereo? Seems like the majority of the discs I've ever seen are mono, so a stereo player would play them in mono. But I'll admit, the stereo discs are nicer in stereo. But some of the old mono players look better than the stereo models. I ended up buying a stereo board from CEDatum - I don't know how many they still have, but with that board, you can convert a mono player to stereo, though you will have to change out several components on the signal board in the player. I was going to do this, and still plan to someday, but right now, I have Electrical Engineering classes to finish, a guitar amp to rebuild, plus I'm coming up with the design for another custom guitar (I have a Strat with a Tele mode - now I want a Tele with a Strat mode), so I just plain don't have the time to do the stereo conversion (and I really don't have too many good movies on CED right now anyway), so it may be a while before I do the conversion, but when I get it done, I'll certainly share how to do it with anyone interested.

[Cubey]

A cheap and easy solution to this is find an old VCR of any kind, even if it won't play tapes. They have A/V output along with RF input. You can usually always use RF input, use the VCR's tuner, and use the VCR's A/V output to send the VCR's tuner signal as A/V output. If you don't have a VCR, Just find a free, dead one and you have yourself a tuner for any A/V TV or monitor.

[cbertra2]

Converting an RF signal back to composite defeats the purpose for having a composite video output. You might as well just use the RF right out of the player. The video is so much better thru the composite output, The color is better and has less picture noise or grain.

[Cubey]

[Red October]

The major ramifications of this that I first noticed were of things like portable TV sets. Those without antenna or A/V input will become entirely useless when this happens. Granted those are few and far between in my experience (even older sets tend to have 1/8" jacks for antenna input, the adapters for these show up now and again and tend to make you go "???" if you've never seen what they're for before as the 1/8" jack is usually for audio signals), but while you may be able to use them with external devices, it pretty much destroys the purpose of having a portable television set in the first place if you need some sort of external device to use it.

As to "Tunerless TVs", wouldn't these, by definition, be Monitors, and not TVs, and wouldn't they, as monitors, not need to have such things as V-chips or Closed Captioning? (I've got nice Sony monitors here [the "Sony Design" line -built like a tank!] that don't even have speakers!) I've also seen some televisions (usually older and very low-end models) that have nothing but internal antennae. All these will become useless as well.

[RT9342]

I still wonder if their plan to completely eliminate the analog TV broadcasts will work or fail. Think of how many poor people there are that can't afford HDTV or an adaptor. And many of them watch a LOT of TV. I'm thinking it could result in some major riots that may result in the FCC backing off on the deal. Kind of like when the government tried to go to metric, only this could be much worse - we're talking about TV - what most Americans spend most of their free time watching. Besides, I noticed a problem with the HDTV broadcasts. Many people that I know still use rabbit ears or an outdoor antenna. Some analog stations come in with static, but they're still viewable. But less than perfect digital broadcasts don't come in a little fuzzy - they just plain cut in and out, like digital satelite TV when a severe thunderstorm comes through. That would really make a lot of people mad. My mom bought an HDTV, but still has to view most local channels on satelite or analog broadcast for that very reason - the analog broadcasts are not that fuzzy, but the digital broadcasts are off-on-off-on-off-on......
And mono CED players won't be the only thing that won't work on the next generation TVs. Anyone still play their old Atari? Of course, like a CED player, if you don't mind modifying your machine, you can get audio/video from it (what's really nice about the Atari is that it the audio/video chip actually generates stereo audio, except in PAL systems, and generates S-video, something you can't easily get from mono CED players).

[Spirantho]

On a slight tangent...

I keep on finding the same people in many of my interests and hobbies. I bring this up because most people would never know that only NTSC Ataris have stereo audio and that PAL ones are mono, so I suspect at least one person here knows his way round a TIA....!

I wonder if there's anyone else on this board who's also a member of other forums I'm on like atariage.com (the best Atari forums, I think) or recordcollectorsguild.org (a pretty good vinyl collecting site, which I'm also into). No-one here drives a Volkswagen Scirocco like me do they?

Given the analogue nature of the CED and vinyl, though, I'd bet most people on this site have a fair LP collection too!

Do other people get this effect, where people who like one thing tend to like the same other apparently-unrelated things?

Tangent over.
_________________
Ian Gledhill
IanG@--remove this--amiganet.org (remove -- to --)

[RT9342]

Yep, I for one am still into Atari (though I rarely have time to play video games anymore) and vinyl (though I prefer new vinyl - you get 24-bit mastered recordings that aren't downconverted to 16-bit, and new bands too - I have an album of my little brother's previous band). I, too, wonder how many other CED collectors are into that stuff too. I know some CED collectors seem to be into 8-tracks. I tried getting into those, but I can see why they weren't successful. I guess many of us who are into CEDs also enjoy other stuff from the same time period. But I'm sure this doesn't apply to everyone. I wonder how many of you prefer laserdisc over CED like me. I just wish that the DiscoVision website had a forum. Blaine's a really nice guy, but it seems that he doesn't have enough time to finish or add on to his website.

[rsrendfeld]

A few weeks ago I found a Dimensia TV (Model #FPR2722N built May 1987) at the Salvation Army Store on North Michigan Road here in Indianapolis. It looked good, had a good picture, good color, good sound and everything seemed to work right.
A week later it was still there and the price was reduced.
A week after that the price was down to "to good to pass up" so I brought it home, plugged it in and waited for it to blow up , melt down or do something else to prove that I'd wasted the money.
Since none of the above happened I figured it would be safe to hook up the rest of the system - so fare so good. The only odd thing about it is a weird BLUE GLOW on the screen right after it is turned off.....
The 20 year old TV has a better picture than the two year old one in our living room - must be the difference between "Made in Bloomington Indiana USA" and Made in Someplaceyoucan'tpronounce PRofC" - and it seems to have better reception too - for the first time ever I can watch the low power Spanish Language channel (I still can't understand a single word they say but the reception is impressive...)
Now that it is hooked up with the rest of the 1987 DIMENSIA System -MPA120 Amp, MPT200 Control Center / Tuner, MCD245 CD Player,
VPT630HF VCR, MGE260 Graphic Equalizer, MTR225 Audio Cassette Deck and the MTT230 Turntable - I am having a lot of fun pushing the buttons on the CRK35A Remote Control just to see what happens.

[Jesse Skeen]

The blue glow when it's turned off is normal; we had an RCA Colortrack 2000 in 1985 that did that. After it was about 10 years old it started going a little nuts though, the channel display would repeat the number all the way across the screen and the picture would randomly cut out.
_________________
Videodisc and stereo sound- there's no better value around!

[rogblake]

[quote="RT9342"]
I know some CED collectors seem to be into 8-tracks. I tried getting into those, but I can see why they weren't successful.[/quote]

I have a large 8-track collection and use them in the car on a daily basis. I also have 8-track recorders so I can pretty much record anything I want onto either erased cartridges or my stash of blanks.

Although the format certainly has its limitations, I don't think it is correct to say that it wasn't successful. 8-Track tape was introduced in the mid-1960s and became extremely popular within a few years. Practically everything released on audio through the 1970s was released in 8-track format. By the early 1980s, the sound quality of cassettes had improved and of course the tapes were smaller and more convenient, so 8-track was waning. Record/tape clubs and late-night TV ads kept 8-tracks going until around 1989. Radio Shack continued selling 8-track players and blank tape cartridges through the mid-1990s.

More than you ever wanted to know about 8-track tape can be found at:

http://www.8trackheaven.com

By the way, I don't have and will not buy an HDTV set. Will just buy used TVs or repair what I've got. (I'm still regularly using an RCA black & white console that was manufactured in 1965.) As far as TV reception when analog goes off the air -- I'm willing to live without it (I have a good collection of material on Beta, VHS, and Laserdisc, as well as CED), but may have to spring for the Cable TV "antenna service" to keep the wife happy.

[Red October]

The big problem with 8-tracks that people remember is poor registration creating mushy sound and two tracks playing at once. This is just because soooo many 8-track players are just rubbish. A good one will sound as good as any other tape device; the tracks are as wide as cassette and the tape speed is good; just most players are not, and after 15-40 years, they haven't held up well. Some later units had dolby; these sound just as good as cassette with dobly. They served their purpose well though, that was cheap, easy car audio.

I'm still using a Colortrac 2000 as my primary set, it's great and still has a strong picture after many years of service. Only problem is it needs re-converging as the picture is very overscanned. It's huge though so I'd likely have to have the tech out here to do it or try myself.

[Marc]

here in Sweden we're already shut down analog http://www.tvinformation.se/tidsplan.asp broadcast by the end of this year.

It's been a lot of questions to the stores, but it starts to sort out for everyone now.[/url]

[7jlong]

I must address one thing about this "merits of 8-Track" thread:

Songs fading out and then fading back in once the program changed is an absolutely ridiculous and horrid way to treat music. The bad old days of having to split up longer recordings (symphonies, opera, etc.) over LPs and tapes is one thing, but when it would interrupt a four-minute song? Stupefying.

It is for this reason alone that I, for one, could never even conceive of taking the format seriously.

[Gunstar]

[Gunstar]

[Gunstar]

[MdntTrain]